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AP1100GTO Issues w/ INDI

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Hey all,

I got Raspberry Pi set up so I can get away from using wINDI and use the normal libraries. Thus far everything has gone smoothly except for my AP1100GTO mount. When I connect with INDI and use the indi_lx200ap driver, the mount will connect, however the RA and DEC values do not update (all zeros, claims the mount is idle) and I get a message that I need to initialize the mount (when it is already initialized via the AP hand control). Furthermore, when INDI is connected to the device, wireless clients like Sky Safari report that they can connect but the scope isn't responding properly. This problem disappears the instant I disconnect the scope from INDI.

In Windows, everything on the mount works flawlessly

Here is what I see when the mount connects:

2017-02-22T11:04:03: Site location updated to Lat 47:58:47 - Long 237:48:00
2017-02-22T11:04:03: Time updated.
2017-02-22T11:04:03: Please initialize the mount before issuing any command.
2017-02-22T11:04:03: Connected successfuly to AstroPhysics.

One quirk, what is up with the longitude reporting the way it does?
7 years 1 month ago #14709

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IIRC there is a switch for cold vs warm start in INDI Control Panel, click one of them, I forgot which and it will start getting back data. For longitude, do not worry it is set by KStars automatically.
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7 years 1 month ago #14713

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Replied by Bill on topic AP1100GTO Issues w/ INDI

The warm setting worked!

Now if the clouds clear up Friday I can finally give the INDI AP setup a live run.
7 years 1 month ago #14727

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Replied by Dan Holler on topic AP1100GTO Issues w/ INDI

Hello IIRC,
A quick question, "Is your system permanent in an observatory or portable on a tripod?"

We've used an AP1600GTO for several years in a permanent setting. We are not using a MAC, but, we do use Linux Mint which might have some similarity to the PI.
Our mount does NOT have absolute encoders. We do have hardware limit switches on the pier. And, I would caution you, we take no responsibility for any damages caused by any advice given here. As you probably know, an AP mount can move very rapidly and forcefully. Make certain your mount is not locked tight on the clutch knobs. Always visually monitor your telescope's movements with a hand on the power switch in case something does go wrong with a slew. We have never struck our pier, though, we have had to emergency stop on some rare events.

Here's a brief outline of our SOP, perhaps, it will help you:

1: We initially setup the AP1600 by the hand control and determined its operation was satisfactory from the internal hand controller database. 'Park' and then set the hand control for 'External' control. We like to use a horizontal tube park position.

2: The AP1600 takes some time on initial powering to boot. Wait before bringing up KStars Ekos. If all goes well, and, KStars has appropriate settings, the 'Start INDI' command and 'Connect' in Ekos will show your mount and other devices. The INDI Control panel window should also open upon Connecting to the devices.

3: Click the mount tab and check to see you mount has connected. If so, click the 'Cold' initialize button. If your parameters are all in KStars, you should see the mount icon appear on the KStars star map. If your park position has been saved in KStars, your telescope icon and the map should correspond. IF they do not, you must use the KStars 'Sync' command to move the icon to correct position. Do not attempt to slew. Place the cursor on the approximate position on the KStars map. Right click and drop down to the mount commands, drop further down that menu to the Sync. Click Sync. At this point, you should have a mount pointing and map correlation which are very close.

4: We like to slew to a mount 'friendly' known star on our first move. By that I mean, do not slew to Polaris in case your time is not correct. If all goes well, you will get a slew to that area. We then use 'Align and Slew' function for the Astrometry. Using downloaded catalog files, astrometry should solve well within a minute, if not seconds. The mount will make some slight adjustments and the target star should be centered in perhaps 1 or 2 iterations of astrometry.

I can not stress enough to be monitoring the mount and make certain its not in danger on your first slews. Once KStars and mount have a good sync, everything will be a whole lot less tense. We always use KStars to park and save position data for the mount, and, we always park at the end of session.

Warm initialize is used whenever we have a system failure such as a software lock up. If the mount were tracking, we can reboot the computer, load KStars, reconnect, and use Warm initialize to resync the software and mount.


Good luck,
Dan
Last edit: 7 years 1 month ago by Dan Holler.
7 years 1 month ago #14735

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Replied by Bill on topic AP1100GTO Issues w/ INDI

I am not permanently mounted at this point, so my AP1100 is mounted on a Losmandy HD Tripod in my back yard. I have APCC connected to the mount at all times as a measure of security in the event that the mount starts to do things that I do not want it to. My initialization is done with the hand control, including the initial star sync. From there I will allow other applications to interact with the mount.

I am curious if the "Sync" command in the INDI driver is sending a SYNC to the mount or an RCAL command. The latter is what AP prefers, as normal SYNC commands can cause issues, like the mount getting completely lost and errant slewing. They usually make up for this by having their ASCOM driver and APCC convert any SYNC command send to them into an RCAL.

Regardless, in my current workflow only the hand controller is sending any RCALs that I am aware of, and does it per their code. I do also connect SkySafari to the mount from time to time, but its syncing is done via an RCAL (confirmed with the devs for SSPro).
7 years 1 month ago #14737

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Replied by Bill on topic AP1100GTO Issues w/ INDI

Wanted to add some additional information to this thread. More specifically about the command used to SYNC an Astrophysics mount.

In the indi_lx200ap driver there are two options for how SYNC commands are handled. :CM# and :CMR#. This is a very important distinction, according to the folks at AP. The preferred method of SYNC commands to their mounts is RE-CAL, which is :CMR#.

Here is info directly from their public documentation on the mount:
www.astro-physics.com/tech_support/mounts/protocol-G.pdf

Command: :CM#
Response: “Coordinates matched. #”
(there are 5 spaces between “Coordinates” and “matched”, and 8 trailing spaces before the “#”, the total response length is 32 character plus the “#”.


Calibrate mount (Sync). Current Right Ascension and Declination become the commanded Right Ascension and Declination respectively if in RA-DEC mode. If in ALT-AZ mode, then the commanded Altitude and Azimuth become the current. This command assumes that the mount has been manually positioned on the proper pier side for the calibration object. This command is ignored if slewing is in progress. This command should be used for initial calibration. It should not be used after the mount has been tracking unless it is known that it has not tracked across the meridian. Please refer to the most recent version of the Keypad Manual for a complete discussion of how Sync and Re-Cal should be used.

Command: :CMR#
Response: “Coordinates matched. #”
(there are 5 spaces between “Coordinates” and “matched”, and 8 trailing spaces before the “#”, the total response length is 32 character plus the “#”.


Re-calibrate (Re-Cal) mount. This command performs a function very similar to the :CM# command with one exception. It does not assume that the user has manually positioned the mount on the proper pier side for the object in view. It assumes that the pier side has not changed since the most recent :CM# or :MS# commands. It allows re-calibration on known coordinates even if the mount has tracked across the meridian.

With all of this said, the provided APCC and Astro Physics ASCOM drivers convert all SYNC commands sent to them into RE-CAL commands. SYNC can be used in the event that you are positive that the scope and the object are on opposite sides of the meridian, and only when you are doing your initial calibration. After that you should only send :CMR# (Re-Cal) commands to the mount.

Here is the caution from the AP hand controller documentation:
www.astro-physics.com/tech_support/mount...ad/keypad-manual.pdf
Page 54-57 talks about SYNC vs RE-CAL.

CAUTION: It is important to note that external software programs may not make the same distinction between the 2 terms, so be careful when syncing or re-calibrating (or whatever they call it) with other programs. For safety sake you may want to treat any similar command in external software like a Sync command and use it only with the object and telescope on opposite sides of the meridian.
7 years 1 month ago #14748

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Replied by Dan Holler on topic AP1100GTO Issues w/ INDI

Hello IIRC,

My apology for the long delay on this topic. As you know, your mount and ours is not the same model, nor is it the same firmware. Based on what you have mentioned, you use yours portable, initialized using the AP hand control, and, it appears to flow from the mount to KStars. This raises a question, on which device you use to slew to your target objects? Hand controller or KStars? I am also curious to ask how things are going?

As I have mentioned before, we are using a fixed observatory. Items such as the site location coordinates, park orientation, elevation, etc. are not changing from use to use. This does allow us to not require physical use of the hand control for initialization. Such a difference might be significant in any directions we provide, however, I would like to try. I am attaching some screen shots and wonder if you might comment if your system appears similar. Or possibly, if you could post some screen shots.

The Beforeinit screen shows where KStars believes our mount is pointing after INDI is started and Connection is made. But, no mount commands are sent or received.
The Aftersuccess screen shows us opening the INDI control panel and issue of the Cold Initialization command. (I need to confirm the actual CMR# is what is sent)
The Afterinit screen shows the result position in KStars of the Cold Initialization on the mount.

Dan
Last edit: 7 years 3 weeks ago by Dan Holler. Reason: Explain what the 3 attachments illustrate.
7 years 3 weeks ago #14997
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Replied by Bill on topic AP1100GTO Issues w/ INDI

I slew to objects via KStars. So far I have only been able to test due to weather conditions but those tests are all working correctly. My experience is the same as yours from your screenshots.
7 years 3 weeks ago #14998

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Replied by Dan Holler on topic AP1100GTO Issues w/ INDI

Thanks much for the quick reply and input.

I will try to post some additional information about our experiences.

For example: During our session last evening, KStars spontaneously closed. In our case, this situation does not pose a significant issue. We simply restart KStars, Open Ekos, Start INDI, Click Connect. Then, Open INDI Control Panel and click the WARM initialize. This automatically picks up our position and tracking.

For us, the most important thing is suspending tracking if a meridian or horizon problem is imminent. We have only noted KStars to execute a meridian flip during image sequences, not during routine tracking.

Best wishes for clear skies,
Dan
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7 years 3 weeks ago #14999

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