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INDI Library v1.8.0 is Released (27 Jul 2019)

INDI Library v1.8.0 is mostly a maintenance release to fix a few bugs in several drivers.

USB hubs - a never ending story

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Replied by pch on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

I agree that some hub work better than other and there is probably a hardware implementation reason for that.
But we must also remember some basic plumbing rules: it is not possible to connect two camera that use 100% of the usb bandwidth and try to put the two flux in one cable.

Personally I always use separate direct cable from the computer to the camera and guide camera. But the hub is OK for the mount, the focuser, the filter wheel and probably other low bandwidth devices.
This meant you need at least 3 usb port on the computer and be sure it not use an internal hub for the two camera ports.
The following user(s) said Thank You: MiHell, JCJ
8 months 3 weeks ago #31968

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Replied by fcasarra on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

Watch out also "active" USB cables. They have a 1 to 1 hub embeded in order to extend length, but can be troublesome.

USB has a limit of hubs in cascade it can handle and I think the best practice is to limit using a "computer <-> hub <-> devices" configuration.

Some years ago I tried to use 2 active USB cables to comunicate my computer to my telescope, camera, etc. It had a random behavior.
Now I has the configuration "computer <-> ethernet <-> old laptop <-> hub <-> 4 devices (ST8, FS2, MaxDome, Robofocus)" working ok.
8 months 3 weeks ago #31972

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Replied by suvowner on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

so would most agree that best practice is to have a powered hub connected to the pi and the devices connected only to the powered hub ??
8 months 3 weeks ago #31975

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Replied by TomAstro on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

Hi all,

I am not expert in linux what so ever. Try this " Adding dwc_otg.speed=1 to /boot/cmdline.txt" then reboot your RPI3. Plug every of your devices into your 7-ports powered USB hub and try it out. Hope can save the day. :)

Tom
Last edit: 8 months 3 weeks ago by TomAstro.
8 months 3 weeks ago #31976

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Replied by kookoo_gr on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

from my experience i use the usb ports of a pc to run my imaging camera, mount cable and guide camera everything else goes to the hub, but one issue i have is with my atik EFW2 with rpi. The only way the pi can recognize the filter wheel is to connect it at my pi and the imaging camera at my D-link hub. Another issue i had a few days ago is that my dmfc and mount would conflict with each other when my hub was not powered. I have ordered a 10 usb 12v powered startech hub in order to try it and also have an extra usb port for future equipment
HEQ5 Pro Rowan Belt Mod, GSO RC8'', SW ED80, Atik 383L+, Atik EFW2, Atik OAG, SX Lodestar, ZWO ASI 120MC
8 months 3 weeks ago #31978

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Replied by stash on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

DSLR's dont count they provided their own power so are quite happy being plugged in to RPI USB port - just make the cable as short as possible and best quality for signal strength. For the UK Lindy cables are very good. Never had problems using DSLR with this method - hence using Remote Indiserver is ideal on different RPI's IMO
RPI3 Ubuntu 16.04 / AMD desktop Kstars under Ubuntu 16.04 Mounts :azeq6 ,SWAZGoTo

RPI3 Fedora testing out on AMD desktop Fedpra 28 - running kstars 2.9.4 , Indilib 1.7.4 ?????
8 months 3 weeks ago #31979

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Replied by MiHell on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

stash is correct about the power consumption of DSLRs as well as all separately powered devices draw hardly any current from the hub.
However beware that non-powered USB2 devices can draw up to 0.5 A and USB3 devices up to 0.9A per port. Using a 10 port hub with a 2.5A power supply might be on the low side.
To complicate things even more the USB-C connector (which I have not seen on astro devices yet but only on cell phones and tablets) may draw up to 3A per port. So don't charge Your cell phone from the same hub when using it for internet connections ;-)

And to top all this: USB-PD (USB Power Delivery) may request 5V, 12V or even 20V and up to 5A (= 100W max power) from the charging device! These values are considered for USB connected displays for example. But it will take some time before we see devices like these at our telescopes.
8 months 3 weeks ago #31980

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Replied by Ihoujin on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

Unfortunately a lot of hubs on the market use cheap components that can be very sensitive to environmental factors, particularly temperature. There are plenty of industrial grade hubs on the market for top dollar, but I have had good success when I switched to this 7 port USB3 hub from StarTech. (3 charge, 4 Data)
www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00HNWY9SW
I have operated with this in the dead of winter under -25°C without a hitch. It powers my RPi3, and up to 2 USB dew heaters. Plus it controls my Guide Cam, DSLR, and memory stick with one port to spare. My Pi's USB ports are occupied with the Hub, Mount, WiFi and USB extension cable to a tablet and keyboard via another powered hub at my table.
INDI/KStars on Raspberry Pi 3B+
Lubuntu 16.04
Skywatcher HEQ5 Pro Mount
Canon 600D Camera
Orion SSAG @280mm Guide Scope
PHD2
Adafruit Motor Hat shield
Adafruit GPS Module
Generic Bluetooth Joystick.
Startech 7 port powered USB Hub.
8 months 3 weeks ago #31990

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Replied by fmozza on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

Ihoujin wrote: Unfortunately a lot of hubs on the market use cheap components that can be very sensitive to environmental factors, particularly temperature. There are plenty of industrial grade hubs on the market for top dollar, but I have had good success when I switched to this 7 port USB3 hub from StarTech. (3 charge, 4 Data)
www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B00HNWY9SW
I have operated with this in the dead of winter under -25°C without a hitch. It powers my RPi3, and up to 2 USB dew heaters. Plus it controls my Guide Cam, DSLR, and memory stick with one port to spare. My Pi's USB ports are occupied with the Hub, Mount, WiFi and USB extension cable to a tablet and keyboard via another powered hub at my table.


You're right about the quality of USB hubs. I have success with this USB2 hub from coolgear:

www.coolgear.com/product/usb-2-0-over-ip...e-over-tcpip-network

I have had this in my obs for about 6 years powered up and temperature ranging from -40C to +40C. So far so good ... These are a little more expensive, but you can save on gray hair tonics.

jmh
8 months 3 weeks ago #31992

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Replied by JCJ on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

I would like to add a point to this topic concerning the mixture of USB 2 and USB 3 devices connected to a same hub.
Remember to connect FIRST the USB 3 devices (cameras in my case) to the hub, and THEN the additional USB 2 devices (scope in my case).
The first device you plug in will configure the port, so always connect USB 3-capable hubs or devices first.
If you plug in a USB 2 hub first, all devices connected or "daisy-chained" to that hub will operate up to the maximum transfer rate of USB 2 speed (480 Mbps).
If you are on Apple, check connections with System Information (Apple () menu > About This Mac > System Report, then select : Hardware / USB, use ⌘R Refresh Information)
THEN power up the devices and start the astronomy software.
7 months 19 hours ago #33798

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Replied by JCJ on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

No eBay APP ID défined in Kunena configurationWhile I am at it, I have been surprised that this USB 3 hub always connects my USB 3 cameras first, and not my USB 2 scope !
7 months 19 hours ago #33799

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Replied by starman345 on topic USB hubs - a never ending story

JCJ wrote: I would like to add a point to this topic concerning the mixture of USB 2 and USB 3 devices connected to a same hub.
Remember to connect FIRST the USB 3 devices (cameras in my case) to the hub, and THEN the additional USB 2 devices (scope in my case).
The first device you plug in will configure the port, so always connect USB 3-capable hubs or devices first.
If you plug in a USB 2 hub first, all devices connected or "daisy-chained" to that hub will operate up to the maximum transfer rate of USB 2 speed (480 Mbps).
If you are on Apple, check connections with System Information (Apple () menu > About This Mac > System Report, then select : Hardware / USB, use ⌘R Refresh Information)
THEN power up the devices and start the astronomy software.


Thanks for posting this, now my ZWO ASI294 camera transfers files at usb3.0 speeds to my NanoPC-T4 device, it never occurred to me to pay attention to the order of plugging in usb3 and usb2 devices.
-Brian

Kstars-Ekos-INDIE
NanoPC-T4 - Armbian Ubuntu 18.04
iOptron CEM25P mount
Photoline 80mm triplet
ZWO ASI294MC Pro Imaging camera
ZWO ASI290MM mini Guide camera


Last edit: 7 months 14 hours ago by starman345.
7 months 14 hours ago #33809

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